Today, we're talking about branding with Emerson (Skip) Robbins, one of the most successful independent retailers in the country.  Skip is co-founder of Robbins Bros., The World's Biggest Engagement Ring Store, currently grossing over $100 million annually, as well as founder of E. E. Robbins, The Engagement Ring Store. Within the last five years, E.E. Robbins has opened two locations, one in Seattle and one in Bellevue. It now grosses close to $10 million annually.  Skip is also the owner of Emerald City Marketing, a branding and marketing company as well as Sure Nature, a health supplement company.  

I agree with you, it's a misunderstood and way overused cliché. Basically, in one sentence, what do your customers know you for? It's as simple as that. If your customers can't sum up who you are and what you're about in one sentence, you definitely aren't branded.

So, one measure of a well-branded company is that you could walk up to someone's customer and ask them what they know them for and they would tell you.

If you said "Starbucks," you'd say they're known for coffee.  If you say "McDonald's," they're known for hamburgers and fast food.   Nordstrom's is branded for quality clothing, shoes and service.  But service would be their brand. That's what their brand is about.  Volvo would be about safe cars.  In one word are you known? And what are you known for?  If you aren't known for something, you're known for nothing.   

So, what are the components of a good branding? 

First of all, the biggest mistake companies make is they want to be all things to all people, and it's just not possible. It's especially difficult if you're a small company with a limited budget. You have to be courageous and take a stand. And you have to find out what is it that turns you on in business. Find something that's meaningful that excites you in business and go after that. And it doesn't necessarily have to be everything you do, but it should be an important part of what you do. But if you're going to develop a brand, you first have to decide who you are, who you want to be, and then become it.

So it starts with what am I passionate about?

I believe so. I think that what you're passionate about you're just simply going to do better. Now, if I'm a jeweler and, for example, I'm passionate about scuba-diving, I could do scuba-diving jewelry, but obviously if it's too narrow a niche, it's going to limit your success.

I know a jeweler who does that actually.

There you go. So, it has to be a meaningful passion, relative to your business. It's not a hobby. Your business is your business. Some people may treat it like a hobby. But it has to be meaningful to a large enough number of people in your market. 

For example, some people love the designing part of the jewelry business. We have a local store here in Seattle that does a great job of that, Green Lake Studio. I think there is a great opportunity for a national niche just like that. There's no company that does that. We live in this kind of homogenized world with all these huge corporate entities. And it's becoming more and more that way in every business. Your pharmacies, your drug stores like Rite Aid and in hardware, you have Home Depot and so on. And if you're a jeweler, you're probably competing with Sterling Merchandise, with stores like Jared Gallery and their many other brands. Zales has three or four different store brands. Big companies like Berkshire Hathaway are even in the jewelry business-owning chains like Helzberg and Ben Bridge. But there are many opportunities in every industry for a number of different brands that have not been done, at least not on a national basis. In this day of mass merchandisers, big box retailers, e-tailers, etc., you had better be known for something. And it'd better be unique and different.

When one of your clients or someone else you think has a feel, and has done a good job with this, what happens in that company? What are the changes you see happening with that company?

First of all, one has to understand that just having a brand and a focus isn't going to automatically make you successful. This is important to get. If you weren't successful as a jewelry store or a drug store, chances are you are not going to be successful at whatever you're focusing on. You still have to execute. You still have to have the right merchandise. the right marketing, the right people. You still have to run your business well, but you also have to be somewhat single-minded.

So, it starts with a passion - find your focus, be single-minded.

That's right. And then about 1,000 other details!

And then a miracle happens.

Well, that's the thing. I always tell clients this is the biggest mistake business people often make. They’re looking for a magic wand, especially in advertising. And advertising agencies capitalize on that. They come in and design some slick campaign that makes the owner think that people are going to line up outside their door. They show the owner their name in a TV ad or let them hear it in some clever radio campaign and they get all juiced up. They get the owner to think that this campaign is going to turn their business around immediately. The customer then responds or doesn't respond. However, if the customers do show up and come into a store that’s lacking the right merchandise, or where the store look or feel doesn't tie in with the advertising message, or the people aren't warm and friendly, or any key part of their business just isn’t right; then all that money that has been spent to bring these customers in is a waste. If you bring in a lot of customers but the sales closing rate is ridiculously low, then all you're doing is spending money to lose money. It's a huge mistake. A business is basically no different than building a house or a building. If the foundation is weak, it won’t support whatever is above it.

The foundation being good product or service, right for the market. The basics. Well-trained employees, the basics that we all talk about.

The right marketing, merchandising, proper financials; you know, a great operation with great people. That's what I do in my marketing business. What I do is say, hey, let's first look at our foundation. Is it strong? Where can we improve it? Yes, we want to develop what you're all about, and we will do that simultaneously. But if we start advertising before we have these other things in place, I'm just wasting your money, and I'm not going to do that.

And how do you go in and make that assessment? As an example, do you survey, or do an on-site visit?

Yes. I meet them. I listen to the owner and investigate almost every part of their business. I meet with their people. I look at their location, their competition, talk with their people, review their marketing, their merchandise. And I shop them as a customer would because basically, that's the eyes we need to look at their business with.

And you also go out and look at their competitors as well? 

I do. I don't think that's as critical, but it's important to understand if you're going to develop a brand, what are your opportunities? If there's somebody who's already the big dog, well… let's say you want to go into jewelry design and you've got a competitor that's already very well branded for jewelry design and does a good job, I wouldn't advise necessarily doing that. Just know that you're probably going to come in second for a long time. They've already proven that in most marketing studies. If someone comes in, for example, what's the first name you think of in rent-a-car?

Hertz.

Okay. Right. Now, Hertz may no longer be number one, but you automatically thought Hertz because they became the biggest first, see? So, it's not easy to overcome that. They, to some degree, own that name "rental car." I think Enterprise is now bigger than Hertz but that took a lot of money and a lot time.

Well, and then I think of Avis whose strategy –

Try harder.

-is just to acknowledge that they were number one

Which was a brilliant strategy.

Yes, and get past that.

But they have determined that if you have a strong niche, a strong brand, you're going to own approximately and this is very rough, but this is according to Al Ries and Jack Trout who did, "22 Immutable Laws of Branding" and "22 Immutable Laws or Marketing," considered among the foremost marketing experts in the world. And they determined that if someone comes in and owns a brand, most likely they're going to own up to a 50 percent share. The next guy, even if he does as good a job as the first guy, he's going to own half of that first guy's share. And it goes down from there. It doesn't mean that you can't overcome; it's been done. But it's very, very difficult. And normally in order for it to be done, the first company in has to kind of “drop the ball”, to lose a significant portion of their market share by not performing to customers expectations. 

Which gets back to the power of branding - why you want to do it in the first place, because once you have your brand that everybody else would be meandering around out there. 

That's exactly right. The funny thing is like here - I am in the engagement ring business, and some people think, oh, that's a magic wand; Just engagement rings, that's going to make me successful. Well, it won’t. I can tell you for a fact that I know a lot of people who have tried to copy our success and have failed dismally. In order to do it you have to determine - can you do it well? You take any business, there are so many components of business within that. You've got maybe 25 percent of a jeweler's business usually is bridal, okay? Ten percent of a jeweler's business is often watches. Well, there's very successful operations like Tournneau that even though ten percent of a jeweler's business is selling and repairing watches, Tournneau is a watch-niched business. Are you familiar with Tournneau? They do huge volume because they're taking a portion of every jeweler's watch business in their market and doing it much bigger and better. And the end result is they have a company that's more successful doing less things than most other companies that are trying to do more.

And you could do that with jewelry design. You can do it with watches. You can do it with dozens of different niches or categories within the jewelry industry. I'm sure this applies to pharmacy, drug store, optician, you name it.

Yes. And I don't think it's bad you're talking about jewelers because between our two groups, the jewelers and the pharmacists, I see far more similarities as independent versus the big boxes, the big chains, than I do see the differences.

Now, bear in mind that in a small community you have to be more things to more people. But on the other hand, you're able to brand yourself more easily. You don't care about branding yourself in the entire state of Washington, for instance, if your store's only in Walla Walla. You want to brand yourself in Walla Walla, and that's an easier job.
So, in Walla Walla, Washington, where I don't know what the population would be, but it's limited. You would be more things to more people. You'd need to stand for more. Maybe your niche would be more comprehensive. Maybe it would be diamonds, which is a larger niche. It would have to appeal to a broader spectrum of the population in order to be successful.

What would be the difference to you between a niche, having a niche in something like engagement or design or whatever, versus being a category killer? Is there a difference? I hear those terms thrown out a lot.

Category killer to me would imply that you, first of all, totally dominate your niche and that's all you do, rather than a specialty.

So, you would be a category killer.

Robbins Bros has become a category killer, but they are not mutually exclusively terms. Both Robbins Bros. and E.E. Robbins are niche businesses. An example of a jeweler with a broader specialty would be like the Shane Company. They can be thought of as a specialist. Even though they do a lot of things, people think of them for diamonds first, because that's what they advertise. They carry pearls. They carry gold chains. So, they’re not really a category killer, or even a truly niche business. But they have a strong identification with diamonds through years of focused advertising. Now they are starting to try and become more things to more people, probably because of increased competition and declining market share.

What would you say to the person who doesn't have a big advertising budget? They're maybe in a more metropolitan well, either way, I don't care what kind of community. Everybody's got a limited budget, and it's so expensive to do advertising.

Well, it does make a big difference. It definitely does makes a difference whether you're in a strong metropolitan area or a smaller rural market because it's easier to get attention in a small rural market. The difficult thing is how do you get attention with a small budget in a large metro? The biggest mistake is to try and spread your media dollars over multi-media. That's the biggest mistake most retailers do. First of all, they have to decide who their target market is, and they have to find a media that specifically can focus in on that target market. You can't afford not to. Your ad dollars are too critical. And then you need to become like the purple cow. You have to stand out in the field, you know.

So, really, whatever they use depends on their situation, their market and, again, being focused just like they are in their branding. Focus and pick your battles. 

There's not one M.O., you know. There is –

There's no magic silver bullet –

No, there isn't.

People come in to our workshops looking for the magic bullet.

They do. Many business owners make the mistake of looking for individuals or companies to do that. Anyone who advises someone to do something specific without knowing their particular situation is probably giving that person the wrong advice. Let's face it - every market is a little different. And so is every business owner. The business has to fit the owner's personality. I use the metaphor that a business is like an orchestra. And I believe that if your marketing, merchandising, store design, people, etc. all don't fit together, it's like having a string section out of harmony with your wind section. If they haven't practiced together, and they don't know what each other's doing, they can’t possibly harmonize and then the sound will not be pretty. And this is one of the dangers of groups as I’ve talked about before. There are great advantages to being in a successful group, but groups can also be very destructive if not used properly. I've seen this happen over and over. What happens is that you take one guy's advertising idea from oh, let's say he had a great radio ad. And then you loved this company's print ad. And then you decide to borrow a great promotion from a third company. And then you put it all together and what you end up with is this patchwork quilt that not only doesn't fit together in advertising; more importantly, it doesn't fit who they are. It doesn't fit your brand. You have to blaze your own path. You can't follow someone else's path. Successful companies blaze their own path. They’re pioneers!

So, I keep hearing this theme, it goes back to take a stand, know who you are, know what you want.

It’s a kind of “search and rescue mission” - that's what it really is. You scout ahead and see what the possibilities are. I'll sit down with an owner and go through a list of things. What do you love? What do you envision yourself doing? What's your favorite part of the business? What's your least favorite? Who do you have in your market that's your biggest competition? All these things and a lot more. Then you determine a path, and go after it. And don't look for the magic wand. Remember that no business is an overnight success, but it's amazing what you can do when you get the formula right. In 1995 when we built Robbins Bros., it took less than eight or nine years to get to something like $100 million in annual volume. And now at E. E. Robbins, where our goal has not been to have more than a few store locations, we are close to an annual volume in less than five years, of around ten million. These things are very possible.

So, you did that applying what you had learned at first with your brother.

Obviously it didn't happen overnight, it was a journey and accumulation of years of searching. We didn't graduate college and all of a sudden say, hey, I know what to do. There are people like that, and God love them, you know? That's great. We first expanded to a chain of jewelry stores until we had about 14 or so mall locations. And we were pretty successful. But after a while our market became saturated with other mall jewelry stores doing the same things we had been doing and soon we found that we were losing market share. We were doing well within our market, but we could see that the world was changing and we needed to change in order to get to a higher place. And so after our own search and rescue mission, a lot of traveling around the country, and so on, we decided a major change was in order. And we used mentors. We didn't try to do it by ourselves. We tried to benefit from the experience and success of others. There may be somebody in another market who's doing great, who is in the same business you could learn from, or a company that is very successful in your own market, but in a different industry that you could learn from. 

But, again, it goes back to at some point you guys had to decide that you were doing, okay, enough in the mall stores, but it wasn't going to be your future. But you didn't just leap.

Well, we did leap. I mean, it is a leap.

But it wasn't a blind leap.

No, it wasn't! It was more of an educated guess as to what would work, really. I mean, there just are no short-cuts. How did we know? We took a successful company down. We self-liquidated a successful company. And everybody said we were nuts. But we knew we were in a leaky rowboat. And if we wanted to get into a big, beautiful yacht, we were going to have to sink that boat.

Speaking of educated guesses, marketing research, in terms of looking at the numbers and the statistics in the market area, how much of that do you use? How detailed do you get on that?

I have used customer research rather than marketing research for the most part. Marketing research is great. However it can also be very expensive. You can go to your local college. At times, market research oftens asks too many questions and isn't always specific enough. They try to accomplish maybe too much. And in doing so they often don't accomplish anything.

I think customer research is more apropos, more successful. We've used market research. Robbins Bros. has done quite a bit. And at times it's been helpful and at times it's been misleading. I'll give you an example. Robbins Bros. ads are kind of Smothers Brothers like. They're truly goofy. But they do get attention.

So, we hired this big market research company. And remember, Robbins Bros. stores are doing incredibly well. The stores do huge volumes. This market research company ran these extensive surveys and they found that a lot of people don't like the Robbins Bros. ads. They're stupid; they're goofy, blah, blah, blah. And so we started running more customer testimonial ads, you know, more traditional, less off the wall. And customers started complaining; hey, what happened to the Skip and Steve ads? The point is, because they were goofy they stood out in one of the toughest radio markets, one of the most competitive radio markets where there's more radio messages than probably any other market in the country. Those goofy ads stood out. Yeah, a lot of people thought they were stupid, but they still came to Robbins Bros. You're not going to ever make everybody happy. If you try to please everybody, you're going to have generic, boring ads. You have to know that if you stand out, you're going to hear people that don't like what you're doing. If you're pleasing everyone, you're probably not going to stand out.

One of the things that strikes me about your ads for your Seattle stores versus some of the ads I see for other jeweler's stores, it's all about the customer's experience and the experience of being in love, getting engaged, and then this wonderful, romantic experience continues and is enhanced by their process of buying an engagement or wedding rings at your store. And so many of the ads I see for other companies, it's all about the owners, that we have been around forever, we…you know. And they're nicely produced and it's a nice message, but it's like, wait a second, who are we talking about here?

Well, I'll tell you the truth. I think my ads are probably a lot safer than they should be because of my own comfort level. But they are always focused. They're always focused on engagement rings, naturally, because that's all we do and what sets us apart. I think that we could probably be more successful by being a little more dangerous. But, you know…

Especially for that younger guy crowd.

Right. But the truth is we live in an age that is so cynical, people don't believe the owner. You can be the most sincere person in the world and can have a great voice and so on and so forth... I find people are even cynical about our testimonials. Some people don't even believe they're real customers, which is really interesting. And they are totally completely unrehearsed actual customer testimonials. And I'm amazed by how many people don't believe them in spite of the fact that they are totally real. So that just shows you the cynicism that exists today. It's natural and it's understandable because we've all been lied to so many times by marketers, by ad agencies, by big companies; that we don't believe anything any more. We don't believe companies, we don't believe what our political leaders tell us. We just don't trust anymore. So I feel that people are more likely to hear our message from a customer than they are from me, as the owner or a spokesperson. 

It's a shame because an independent business owner has such an incredible inherent advantage over the big box stores, especially in pharmacy. There is a person behind a prescription. You talk about jewelers wanting to build that trust, well, with the pharmacists. I mean, my gosh, if that trust is screwed up on a prescription, you could be dead.

Please don't get me wrong. I think in communities, whatever the size, the owner is still a great spokesperson for his or her company.  I think that's still a great way to go. Tom Shane's proven it. The guy is successful in twenty-some different markets. And yeah, his voice is not the best around, his ads are irritating, but they're remembered. They stand out. They sound real because you know they'd never hire an announcer who sounded like that. Whether you like them or not, I think his ads could be a lot better, no question about it. But they've allowed him great success. He's built one of the most profitable jewelry companies around. So, he's done a great job. Now, he's a case also, kind of the Hertz case of getting there first, you know. And now they'd better be careful. See, that's the way a lot of people think in this industry. Oh, if I open a 5,000 or 10,000-square-foot store, I'm going to be –

Glad you're talking about that!

The truth is, if you haven't been successful in a 1,000-square-foot store, you're sure as hell not going to be successful in a 5,000 or 10,000-square-foot store because if you don't have your basics down, it just becomes magnified. And you've just got more on the line.

It's like building a bigger house on the same original bad foundation.

That's right.

That’s a really good point. I hear so many owners say, oh, if I only could get out of this mall location by the corner, down the street, etc. In the meantime, staff isn't trained and the store is crummy.

It's kind of like playing blackjack; if you haven't been successful with the $5 bet, don't put $100 down every hand.

Especially with borrowed money.

Right.

And you go in their store and things aren't right; again, foundation issues haven't been addressed.

Right. Now their threshold and risk factors are that much greater. Because the truth of the matter is, now there isn't just one big box store in most markets. For example, in Seattle there are five companies that have multiple big box jewelry stores. And we've only seen the beginning. This is a trend that is going to continue. Which of the big box stores will succeed? It's going to become like mall stores were in the '80s; you’ve got 15 or more jewelry stores in some of the major malls. And which ones succeed? The pie gets cut up in a lot more pieces.

Yes. So, the same thing's happening.

We are over-retailed. That’s a fact. It doesn't matter what industry - we are over-malled, over-retailed. Statistics will show you that. Yes, there are still incredible opportunities in business. There are always new brands, new ideas just waiting to happen. But in terms of the traditional brands, the traditional industries, we are way over-retailed as a country. It's becoming tougher and tougher; everybody knows that. It's more and more important to stand out, have your act together.

Describe an ideal client.

An ideal client is someone who is ethical, first of all. Integrity comes first. They have to be a caring person. They have to genuinely like and respect their people because their people are going to make them successful. They're not going to make their people successful by their own efforts alone. You have to have great people in almost any business, especially in a competitive retail business. And you have to have faith and patience because nothing great happens overnight. And anyone who promises overnight success is a fraud, a modern day medicine man.

What would you tell a business owner who's burned out?

Sell the business. Sell now or get reinvigorated. Find a new passion. Find a way to reinvigorate themselves.

In your business or out of your business.

Absolutely. But let me say this: There is nothing more exciting than turning your business around; changing your business and making it different. Most people take the safe route, you know? And the cautious route is the most dangerous route, let's put it that way.

Do you think some people are scared of success?

No. I don't think anybody's scared of success. I think that's a myth. I think that people are scared of new challenges. They're scared of change. I absolutely love meeting with a new client, even if they're burned out, and showing them the opportunities to change and metamorphose their business completely. It's great. It's like starting over. You get to wipe the slate clean, and start over new. Now we get to do it just the way we want. Many people get caught up in this stuff, and especially second and third-generation businesses which a lot of these businesses are. They often inherited a lot of stuff that if they had the opportunity to start over fresh, they wouldn't necessarily do the same way. We were a third-generation business with one store when my brother and I first started, and our business was truly a dinosaur. We " inherited" not the business but a lot of stuff that came with the business. And then we made changes within that. But the truth of the matter was that " house had to be torn down". Just "remodeling" wasn't enough.

That's a good point because there's lot of great things about tradition, but it can be so heavy on your shoulders, like carrying a dinosaur around.

The world constantly changes. Change is the one thing you can count on, and it's changed dramatically in just ten years. And in many businesses, we're talking about companies that are 20, 30, 40, 50 years and more. Second and third generation businesses. And many are struggling. They're still trying to make this thing work.

The way dad used to do it.

Yes. And the one thing I can say is if you make small changes, the most you can expect are small results. That's one of the things I'm amazed about with people, that people are inherently hopeful, and I guess that's why Las Vegas keeps building so many casinos. The reality is people know rationally that you're going to lose 90% or more of the time when you bet. But people are basically optimists, and they think they're going to be among the few that defy the odds - that they're going to win. Just like jewelers or pharmacists or whatever. They think they're going to make some small changes and they subconsciously expect big results from these small changes. Guess what? Not going to happen.

Hope is not a strategy.

Right.

So, what's the one thing as a business owner reading this, what could they do right now?

Ask themselves, first of all, if they’re willing to make big changes. And if they could wipe the slate clean, how would they start? Then don't try to do it alone. Get help from someone who's been successful. Everybody needs a coach, everybody. Get a good coach or business mentor. The cheapest investment you'll ever make would be a great coach. And there are a lot of good ones out there. It could be a friend in a completely different business that you brought in. Or it could be a board, your own private board of directors made up of successful people in your community that you pay to help you. Maybe one guy's known as a great merchandising guy. Another one is known for outstanding marketing and advertising. Another is very strong financially. Learn from others. 

Recommended reading?

"22 Immutable Laws of Marketing." By Al Ries and Jack Trout. My favorite marketing book. They also wrote the "22 Immutable Laws of Branding." And there is the "Purple Cow" by Seth Godin. I really could have summed up this book in one or two pages, but it gets the message across. “Who Moved My Cheese," because it makes clear that the world keeps changing. It's a parable - a little juvenile, but it gets the point across. I loved the inspiration of the book about Starbuck's, "Pour Your Heart into It." I thought that was a great book, the story of Starbuck's - a new retail concept, a vision that Howard Schultz had that he had the courage to make happen. A phenomenal success story. Another one that helped me personally, but I think it's now a bit dated, is "The Popcorn Report" by Faith Popcorn. It was important to read when we started Robbins Bros. because she saw the future. Now that future is already here and past, to some degree. And a must read are the books Roy Williams, who was one of our personal mentors as well as a close friend. The man is a genius.  His books, " The Wizard of Ads" and " Secret Formulas of the Wizard". Corny titles but both are incredible books. Kind of an Aesop Fables for Business with great stories that teach you about business, and more importantly, life. 

Skip, any other words of wisdom?

Don't be afraid to think big. If you make small changes, the most you can expect is small results.

You have to search for what you want. You know, but change is fun. It's exciting, scary at times – but, it's fun. It gets you going. And as long as it's directed, you know… 

I think the comfort zone is highly overrated.

Oh, the comfort zone is the most dangerous place to be. It really is. It's the most dangerous place to be because if you're successful now and you get too comfortable, well, things are going to change. That you can depend on. And if you stay in your comfort zone, and don't change, you're headed down hill. You have to get out of your comfort zone. You don't have a choice.

Have a question for Skip? Send him an email at emerskip@aol.com. Skip Robbins’ column, featuring answers to readers’ questions, will be featured in future Profit Mastery Newsletters. 

original article can be found at: http://www.brs-seattle.com/ezine-5w.html